What will happen on 1st of June 2006 ?

Discuss the IOM class rules and interpretations

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Eric
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What will happen on 1st of June 2006 ?

Post by Eric » 16 Nov 2005, 09:15

The Using of Lead will be forbidden for Toys, sports and leisure articles.


you can read this here



http://europa.eu.int/smartapi/cgi/sga_d ... l=guichett

What will Change in the Class Rules for Europe ?

Laurent Schock
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Post by Laurent Schock » 16 Nov 2005, 10:05

time to use something else than lead...

a few choices:

http://www.science.co.il/PTelements.asp?s=Density
Last edited by Laurent Schock on 16 Nov 2005, 10:42, edited 1 time in total.
-Laurent Schock

awallin
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Post by awallin » 16 Nov 2005, 10:09

Hi Eric,

the document you linked to(Directive 2002/96/EC) is a bit... long and cryptic...

If you are well versed in the EU documentation, could you pick out for us the relevant paragraphs ?

I've been meaning to try out a solid brass bulb whenever I get my hands on som machining time on a cnc lathe....
I think most ACC bulbs are steel aren't they ?

Anders

Lester
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Re: What will happen on 1st of June 2006 ?

Post by Lester » 16 Nov 2005, 10:12

Eric wrote:The Using of Lead will be forbidden for Toys, sports and leisure articles.
Hi Eric

I don't read that Directive in the same way. As far as I can see, it covers electrical and electronic equipment. I don't think our toy boats are "electrical and electronic equipment". I believe the Directive covers only the radio gear (batteries included) on board.
Lester Gilbert
http://www.onemetre.net/

Eric
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Post by Eric » 16 Nov 2005, 10:40

The problem is that it is only written "Toys containing....." and as soon as you have an electronic component , the use of lead ist forbidden.

in Danmark it is allready forbidden for fishing and hunting for exemple

Jimmy
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Post by Jimmy » 17 Nov 2005, 17:38

VCinfocomms wrote: I think most ACC bulbs are steel aren't they ?
A ACC bulb contains 1.8 cubic meters of lead, VO 60 and 70 also have lead in their bulbs.

//JIMMY

Rob Davis
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Post by Rob Davis » 05 Dec 2005, 23:58

Try using powdered tungsten. You can make any shape you want. Present measurement rules wouldn't find the substrate.

Rob
Rob Davis
USA 232

ole_peder
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Post by ole_peder » 06 Dec 2005, 19:22

Hi
I can't see the problem. What I am sailing is certainnly not a "toy", I wouldn't let any kid near my boat.

No, people, an IOM is a fine tuned piece of racing equipment. Utilizing the latest technology available allowed in the IOM class rules.
Ole Peder Bjørsom
Chairman NOR NCA

Roy Thompson
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Post by Roy Thompson » 08 Dec 2005, 22:16

Rob said:
Present measurement rules wouldn't find the substrate
Could you explain this please Rob?
Thanks
Roy Thompson
"WE DON'T SEE THINGS AS THEY ARE, WE SEE THINGS AS WE ARE" A.N.

cfwahl
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Post by cfwahl » 09 Dec 2005, 03:00

Rule 3.1: Materials shall not be of density higher than lead (11.300 kg/m3).

If you mixed tungsten with some resin, you could get a mixture that did not exceed the density of lead, but the tungsten material (19,250 kg/m3) would not comply. I speculate that Rob's point is that this would be difficult to verify (if the finished bulb had an aggegate density less than or equal to lead).

But this would certainly be an option to avoid anti-lead regulation, if the class chose to go this way.
Charles Wahl

Laurent Schock
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Post by Laurent Schock » 09 Dec 2005, 04:53

I have seen that in Germany they are offering stainless steel bulbs'.

No need to cast anymore! , though I have never done it, I read on several occasions that it could have some health issues.
-Laurent Schock

awallin
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Post by awallin » 09 Dec 2005, 08:41

Laurent Schock wrote:I have seen that in Germany they are offering stainless steel bulbs'.
No need to cast anymore! , though I have never done it, I read on several occasions that it could have some health issues.
Interestign ! do you have some pictures or links ?

Steel (or brass) does not ofcourse have the density of lead, but they are both very much machineable.

A friend of mine who works with modern CNC machines thinks a steel bulb can be CNC machined on a modern lathe in maybe 30min. from say a solid 40mm stainless steel rod. In large quantities this way of making a bulb would not be that expensive.

If I get my hands on some free machining time sometime I will try a stainless steel bulb.

Anders

edmorales

Post by edmorales » 09 Dec 2005, 09:52

hi y'all,
i think bronze or brass is more feasible than stainless steel, it is heavier which equates to a smaller cross section bulb, easier to turn on the lathe and probably cheaper. here is a chart for referrence.

Metal or alloy kg/cu.m
aluminium - melted 2560 - 2640
aluminium bronze (3-10% Al) 7700 - 8700
aluminium foil 2700 -2750
antifriction metal 9130 -10600
beryllium 1840
beryllium copper 8100 - 8250
brass - casting 8400 - 8700
brass - rolled and drawn 8430 - 8730
bronze - lead 7700 - 8700
bronze - phosphorous 8780 - 8920
bronze (8-14% Sn) 7400 - 8900
cast iron 6800 - 7800
cobolt 8746
copper 8930
delta metal 8600
electrum 8400 - 8900
gold 19320
iron 7850
lead 11340
light alloy based on Al 2560 - 2800
light alloy based on Mg 1760 - 1870
magnesium 1738
mercury 13593
molybdenum 10188
monel 8360 - 8840
nickel 8800
nickel silver 8400 - 8900
platinum 21400
plutonium 19800
silver 10490
steel - rolled 7850
steel - stainless 7480 - 8000
tin 7280
titanium 4500
tungsten 19600
uranium 18900
vanadium 5494
white metal 7100
zinc 7135

depleted uranium tops the heap
ed

kure
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Post by kure » 09 Dec 2005, 11:03

I agree with Ole Peder. This is not a problem
This must be regulated at production/sales level not on
users of the equipment.

The producers sell their boats without bulbs.
Bulbs are bought separately (no electronics) and put together privately.

Why not use Gold :) looks good.....
Or Plutonium or uranium .... :evil: I would like to have
a neuclear IOM - cool !
NOR 85

Laurent Schock
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Post by Laurent Schock » 10 Dec 2005, 05:53

VCinfocomms wrote:
Laurent Schock wrote:I have seen that in Germany they are offering stainless steel bulbs'.
No need to cast anymore! , though I have never done it, I read on several occasions that it could have some health issues.
Interestign ! do you have some pictures or links ?

Anders
Image

from the Modellyachtclub Muenchen under tipps

http://www.modellsegeln.net/tipps/tipps.htm

Contact:

Manfred Prothmann
manfred.prothmann@gmx.de
-Laurent Schock

Lester
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Post by Lester » 10 Dec 2005, 10:36

VCmeasurement wrote:Rob said:
Present measurement rules wouldn't find the substrate
Could you explain this please Rob?
I don't think Rob means to use the word "substrate" (the material or substance on which an agent acts, the surface on which an organism grows or is attached, or an underlying layer), I think he simply meant to say that the rules wouldn't necessarily detect the presence of tungsten powder in a bulb.
E.3.1 MATERIALS
Materials shall not be of density higher than lead (11.300 kg/m3).
A measurer, if s/he wanted to check this, would use Archimedes' principle, and see how much water was displaced by the bulb. Although the bulb might well have tungsten powder mixed in, if it displaced at least around 2300 / 11.3 = 208 ml of water (assume bulb weighs 2300 gm) any tungsten (or anything else!) would remain undetected... Which as far as I can see is not a problem. One of those rules (there are quite a few of them!) which are, strictly, unenforceable with equipment and techniques commonly available to IOM measurers.
Lester Gilbert
http://www.onemetre.net/

Rainer
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Post by Rainer » 10 Dec 2005, 19:02

Hi Laurent,

the bulbs on your picture are not stainless steel, they are made from lead. But they have a very smooth surface.

Rainer
Rainer Blank

Laurent Schock
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Post by Laurent Schock » 11 Dec 2005, 04:33

Rainer wrote:Hi Laurent,

the bulbs on your picture are not stainless steel, they are made from lead. But they have a very smooth surface.

Rainer
SORRY for the misinformation, I somehow thought they were made of steel!

Again sorry....
-Laurent Schock

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